Sunday, 1 January 2012

Space Puppies Bite Back (Count As Star Wars!)

 So one of my many many drafts has made it live!! So shut it Ven!

I've been tinkering with the thoughts of some lists that will both be fun to play, won't shoot me in the foot because they suck and have game against most things. Deathwing was A LOT of fun to play, but had so many little problems. I played them well, and felt I could win any match up, but just a bad run of luck would see me going from a sure win to a loss in the matter of a turn or two. Plus I gamed them for a meta that didn't exist (I expected lots of pred Blood Angel lists, lots of Imperial Guard and Hybrid Wolves ... I never faced a BA list with more than 2 pred's). In play testing I frequently had turn 2 concede's from absolutely brutal alpha strikes, in tournaments, I rarely saw those mech gunline lists ... if ever.

So, while figuring out if I want a list for 2012 (and thus what I would look to play), I started with a at the more traditional armies. Out of the most recent codex's, Sisters just disappointed me (if they had a good codex I doubt I would have quit the game, I actually rage eBay'd my entire force since I'd make a profit off kitchen table fluff bunnies), Necron's do nothing for me (absolutely hate the models), Grey Knights bore the socks off me, and while Dark Eldar are pretty interesting, it would take far too large an investment for just casual play.

So as the title suggests, I am looking at puppies today. My bits box and left over sprues support pretty much any MEQ force, especially if I do them as Star Wars count as (which I have extensive bits for, which I never sold in my mass eBay spree)

I wanted a list with plenty of shooting, like the Wolves can achieve, but still have a ton of scoring bodies or units, with a "dedicated" scorer. Now lets face it, the Wolves lists have been thoroughly explored, so I am not going to be fare off the beaten track, but lets see what I've put up:

Wolves 1750 Roster:

Rune Priest - Choser (110) (Jaws and LL or MH)

9xGrey Hunters + MG(5)+Rhino(35) - 175
9xGrey Hunters + MG(5)+Rhino(35) - 175
8xGrey Hunters + MG(5)+Rhino(35) - 160
5xGrey Hunter +MG(5) - 80

WGx5 (90) + CML (45) + 4xCombi (20)+ 3xPF(75)+ LasPlas (75)
Rifleman Dread - 125
Rifleman Dread - 125

5xLong Fangs - 4xML - 115 + LasPlas
5xLong Fangs - 4xML - 115 + LasPlas
5xLong Fangs - 4xML - 115

1750 on the nose by my memory. I haven't seen the codex in about 3 months though!

Theory Behind the List:

The first thing I wanted to do was start with a solid core, which was to be around 30 MEQ to push midfield and be tough to deal with. I've seen how effect 30 GH's can be in the midfield, and pretty much can deal with anything the game can throw at them, especially paired with some hidden power fist action.

Next up I knew I wanted a bit of a mobile gun battery in the rifleman dread. S7 is not to be sniffed at, and considered a beast before the Grey Knights hit, so its still good. By choosing 1 and knowing I had WG, it ruled out Scouts or Loners since I feel both need to be in pairs, since both choices are unimpressive on their tod. A pair of riflemen allows me to play the corners game.

I don't know how many old farts the wolves have, but its probably more than any of their other unit types, since everyone has three. I am no different. Its just hard to argue with 12 S8 shots at 6 different targets. They are also a "you need to deal with them" target, that don't go away with one shot.

Rounding out my core is the wolfguard. Reason I've chosen 5 to get the CML is I wanted to fit in a 5 man "foot squad" of GH's. In objective missions the plonk themselves in cover and sit tight with 2 S8 shots a turn. Oh and not to mention the CML offers a PW if anyone gets too close. There's 1 bullet catcher WG for a fang squad as well.

So I have 30 MEQ pushing midfield, and 21 with 2 dreads sat in the backfield.

What else?

Really its just "fillers" now. I wanted a LasPlas or three - finding I had exactly enough points was a joy. The reason for the split of 2/3 razors to the fangs and 1 to the WG is that while I want deployment options for Dawn of War, I also want the "threat" of deploying a mini-deathstar in a razor and zooming them across the field. Better yet, I can tuck the 5 man foot squad up in that razor if needs be, which I really like.

The CC is not quite there - 3 PF's and a couple of PW's tucked up there are "ok" but not amazing. I have the option of dropping a dread for a couple of thunderwolfs with a single LC (same unit) or could drop 2 of the lasplas and have 2 LC'd Thunderwolves.

Another option is that I could drop both dreads for 2 lone wolves, or take 2 units of scouts and just go the "harass" route.

All I can say is there are options.

That would leave me in a position where I'd just build that core and the odd model I need to swap in / out and would be pretty happy.

Star Wars Count As Potential?

I've said from the get go that if / when I do another army it will be Star Wars Count As.

This force still fits the bill - and maybe more so than my Grey Knight list I originally planned. Better yet, the codex presents so many brutally great options for conversions and alternates that it would be quite easy to run the count as theme not only accurately but without being too "outlandish".

Most of the list is explanatory in what it would be as count as:

Rune Priest - Vader or Papa Emps
Grey Hunters - Storm Troopers
Wolf Guard - Shadow Guard / Royal Guard
Riflemen - AT/ST
Tanks - Transports (may convert a little bit)

The Long Fangs I thought about as "gun droids" which might be cool - using Tau shield drones as a basis, but I want scouts to be probe droids so not sure if that would over lap. Other cool things would be Dewbacks for the thunderwolves, a "real" vader as some stupidly disgusting Wolf Lord. Speeder bikes I'd love - I do actually like the idea of blood claws on bikes - low priority but would be a really nice counter attack unit. 

Next Up:

Blood Angels - potential there for Count As Star Wars and actually be both fun and a tool box. Mephiston in my eyes is the best Darth Vader count as in the game, so definitely worth a look on that merit.


  1. I would 100% love to see you build this!! Think itd be absolutely amazing!!

    I get very excited every time you throw this stuff up...any prototypes yet?

  2. I really want to make a long fang - playing SWTOR today I had a awesome idea for it!

    Need to hit first for that - need tau bits!

  3. For the firstSw list cut 2 from the 9 man squads and 1 from the 8 man squads to give you a nice solid 75 points back... which drum roll please... is enough for another las/plas razor.
    8 man ten man not that much difference really its the motw and fist that get the kills anyway.
    I think the riflemen are solid but I've never been impressed with theiractual kills per game. Id swap them out for some cc element.
    Recommend 2 x 1 thunderwolf ( troopers on dewbacks?) With shield and thammer. Use the last 30 points for anything you see fit ( wolf banners motw etc.)

  4. In honesty rifleman will be in most lists I'd make just because they will be count as AT/ST's for the starwars theme.

    I've done "WAAC" lists and I am not so fussed about nerfing myself a little bit if I was to do the theme, I think it would give me more enjoyment than being completely and utterly efficient. I do say in the post that the CC is not quite where I want and rifle for Loners or Wolves would be better.

    Good shout on dropping to smaller squads.

  5. Put in a order for the conversions for the long fangs.

    I only ordered "a squad" just to see how they come out. They don't use marine bodies which is cool.

  6. Bully: Riflemen are fine I misread about your desire for CC. Although dropping down to 7+1 is the way to go for the gh in rhinos with melta. Are you intending the tda cyclone to go with the 5 man squad and sticking the rune priest with them as a foot objective holder?
    Good luck on the theme!

  7. Yeah that is the basic "idea" for the split. I am defo on board for the 7+1 - seems to work out better.

    The wolfguard present a ton of options which I like. I can do the TDA w/ Rune in the footsquad and basically have a dev squad (prob taking LL and MH then) which would essentially see my back field as 2x Rifle (8 shots) 3xFangs (12 shots) and 1xGHshooters (2+D6, so ~5.5) thats a whopping 25.5 shots from the backfield.

    And it still sticks 25+ MEQ into the midfield, with 4xlasplas + 3xrhinos as mobile bunkers/cover.

    I am almost tempted to put in a misers thunderwolf - while a pair would be much better, I could have a sort of "mini-lord". Can reserve him if need's be.

  8. I agree with you the Lone Wolves being sucky on their own (or as a pair...) but I'm not sure that Scouts on their own are so terrible. They're a nice suicide distraction unit that can dictate where your opponent can deploy and push units toward the centre of the board where your Hunters are waiting for them.

    I'm wondering if a solitary unit of them make a Njal list more viable by pushing enemies into his Lord of Tempest effects, or if it's all the Hunters in Rhinos that will do the damage as in other lists?

    As for the pair of Dreads: would you consider dropping one for a Lasplas and 2 more Long Fangs with Rockets? You lose 4 S7 shots but get another Lascannon for the Fangs and 2 S8 in addition to toughening up 2 of those squads. But then again that's more from the efficiency angle.

  9. Something like that is certainly not out of the question.

    If I do end up building it, I figure that I'd have "2 versions" - the ultra streamlined one, and the one that I use at the LGS - which in reality I was winning with the OLD grey knights (a tri-land raider list at one stage) ... yup not many melta guns there!