Was an immense trip that left me deeply touched and spurred to new heights of philanthropy and a vastly more developed understanding of the human condition.
Or alternatively, it was a cool experience and both myself and the school kids enjoyed it.
Let's go with that over the high 'n' mighty bullshit above.
I did do a lot of thinking though and even braved the expense of int'l roaming charges to view the new Grey Knights and keep in touch with the blog... yes Killswitch and Stargazer...I know...and not like Williams to Damon in Good Will Hunting either...I know...where were your posts bitches?! Over on the SW blog Alex! (shakes head!) lol.
My thinking led me to a dark place where I was a bit bored of 40K and not sure which direction to take for a new project.
When I read Atreides post on 'counts as' a light bulb switched on over my head.
I thought first about how cool it would be to do a 'real' Thousand Sons army using the Grey Knights codex...ushabti would even fit in somewhere.. then I thought of the expense, conversion work involved (due to crappy lack of models and poses for Sons) and sacked that idea off...
But I kept the GK in my head...we all know I suffer from shiny toy syndrome...
How about keeping the red/white marines (my own successor BA chapter - the Blood Hunters) and using them as not only Grey Knights and BA, but go back to the Vanilla marines codex and the Black Templars codex and fill in the units that were required to fit them in...
So how does this 'one army to rule them all and in the red/white bind them' concept work?
Well for BT the only real thing I need is foot slogging Termies with Cyclones or Asscannons for Tank Hunting.
For Vanilla, I'd add TH/SS Termies and maybe some drop podding sternies
For GK's? well, I got myself a quick hair cut today after school and spent a little while reading up the real codex...you know the one, it's the one after Jervis swung away and removed a few cool things from the leaked playtest codex...
I like it and think the key is to keep things simples.
No crazy pointed Paladins or jump jetting Voltron wannabe's.
Just dude menz with big guns.
Also, what to use to represent said guns if I want to keep each army-specific addition cheap?
Heavy Bolters. That is what the Psycannon model looks like to me. It's appropriately sized and easy to establish what it is...and yup, there are plenty online because no one uses them!
I've got Razorbacks, Termie librarian, power-armoured dudes with hammers (Justicar with Master Crafted NDhammer), general PA dudes and of course, Dreadnaughts with dual TLAutocannons.
And just cause it wouldn't be right not to....the first draft GK/Blood Hunters list from SoS using the real codex...
Libbie - TDA. 3 x Servo Skulls (anti-alpha strike FU to IG), powers: Summoning (mobility and pressure where required), Might of Titan (cumulative with Hammerhand? Fuck yeah) and Shrouding (Stealth? oh, go on then. in 6"? Ok, vehicles with a 3+ cover...nuff said)
3 x 10 man GK strike squads with 2 Psycannons, justicar with Master Crafted NDHammer, Razorback with TLAssCannon - Psybolts.
1 x 5 man GK strike squad with Psycannon, Razorback with TLAssCannon - Psybolts
3 x Rifleman Dreads with Psybolts
The full troop squads combat squad giving 7 scoring units and 8 threat vectors if required.
Typically the 2 Psycannons from the squad will go in one unit and the MCNDH-wielding Justicar in the 'PAssBack' (copyright 3++ is the new black...all rights reserved but still used, lol)
The 'PAssBack' pumps out 4 TL S7 rending shots on the move and is scoring, in addition all vehicles come as standard with 'Fortitude' and are psychic pilots, ignoring the dreaded 'stunlock' on a Ld10 psychic test...lol's ensue.
The squads then have 4 S7 rending with 30" range or 8 S7 with 24". Nice. Aggressive deployment ftw? perhaps.
Libbie just joins one of the squads on foot, adds Shrouding for stealth and keeps the vehicles in range if possible for one turn at least, any more is a bonus. Summoning just drags any over extended elements of the army back into contact.
THe servo skulls operate individually and are placed after deployment zones are known, but before sides decided. However, midfield is perfect for them as they mean no scout moves within 12" of each one, combines with your own deployment, this means your parking lot will not be hijacked by alpha strikers. EVER.
Or could switch to a teleport homer for Libbie instead, meaning the Summoning/DS move never scatters?
The riflemen with a 5 point upgrade to make them S8 rather than S7 for 135 points total? yeah, I'll go with that!!
36 space marines
44 S7 rending shots (16 TL'd)
12 S8 TL shots
11 threat vectors at range.
3 S10 Hammer toting tits to tackle other crap like walkers... and Monstrous creatures cause its also a FORCE weapon...whoot!
1750 bang on... thoughts?
What no Dreadknights?.......
No Monkey mobiles?
Welcome back! Nice to see you Yesterday,
ReplyDeleteI like the army using all codexes idea. Thinking of the same with my Fire Hawks have a Ultra and a Blood angel list.
Good luck with the project.
P.S. pop in and sort a game for the badab campaign.
there are so many people on the internet who would go apoplectic with rage at the very thought of this proposal.
ReplyDeletelet me paraphrase:
THEY CANT BE ALL CHAPTERS IF THEY ARE PAINTED AS ONLY ONE CHAPTER!!!! CHAPTERS CANT CHANGE THEIR TACTICS BASED ON THE SITUATION THEY ARE IN BECAUSE DESPITE BEING SUPERHUMAN WARRIORS THEY ARE ENTIRELY UNABLE TO THINK AT ALL AND JUST BLINDLY FOLLOW A STUPID BOOK WHICH WAS ONLY EVER MEANT AS A GUIDELINE. THIS MAKES ME RAGE!!! IT DOESNT MATTER IF THEY ARE A MADE UP CHAPTER! YOUR FLUFF CANNOT BE STRONG ENOUGH TO COVER ALL EVENTUALITIES. YOU ARE KILLING MY HOBBY.
ahem. basically, i say go for it.
@ D... good to see you too mate, if only very briefly. I think the 'Blood Hunters' project could very well solve my shiny toy syndrome...just adding detachments from other codices will help to have a) painted armies all the time and b) variety in my game play.
ReplyDeleteI'll be on on Tuesday and try and organise a game dude.
@Atreides.. i lol'd. All the heavy bolters are ordered and all the company champion shoulder pads ordered for them too...will fit in perfectly...
So you still in for Brighton then? Or what?
nope, sodding step-sisters wedding. i am really pissed about it too. need to cancel the ticket i suppose :(
ReplyDeleteThats a pain Andy, just call in sick on the day, I am sure she won't mind, or question that your doctor is in Brighton ..
ReplyDeleteGood thouhgts Ven - I think the "one army" idea is best. I am gutted that I didn't find my scheme earlier so I could do my Angels as this - but I learnt my lesson - all my marine stuff will be the same now.
I've seen a few people say that Andy "your fluff cant be that good" etc... my answer is "who cares? I've made the chapter up anyway ...." end of the day its not like your actually taking part in a continuous story, if the other person wants to think they are something thats up to them, but if your happy that one day your Chapter of the Awesome like to bite things in combat and that riding on wolves is a good idea, and the next day one of the dudes decides that if he fills a cup with blood and screams a bit that everyone will get overly excited and charge into combat a little bit harder - then that's the way it is.
I am kind of doing the same thing as you Ven though combining Dark Angel models + my terminators (cross breed of marines and grey knights) and my GK's into one glorious ambiguous "chapter".
As for the list - I am not feeling right about these lists atm - I really like the libby and GKM but do not like the idea of them footslogging into battle behind rhino's or razor backs. Having chatted with a mate about it, I am probably going down the "ridiculous" route. Draigo in a stormraven - at the very least making it scout (or outflank) with lots of terms, or a few paladins and a couple of dreadknights (hopefully getting scouting on them as well lol) or something like mordrak and and some terminators in LR/SR. I just don't know if I want to make my GK's razorspam - I was really hoping the psycannons were 36" so a footlist was viable.
i think a foot, or at least a hybrid list, will be completely viable. i'm certainly planning on doing it. if the last tournament taught me anything its that crazy shit can work if you know your army and play well. it might not work as reliably or as often, but with where i am in my head with this hobby right now, thats worth it.
ReplyDelete@Bully.. on lists... I don't think actual razorspam is possible.
ReplyDeleteThe costs of the strike squads etc stop this, that's why I have gone for full size squads to combat squad and use the Razors as unstoppable (lol) chariots for the Hammer Justicar...
They may not even combat squad in KP games, just using the Razors for cover with Shrouding making them damn tough, the vehicles too.
3+ cover on the Dreads from Razors with Fortitude too? that's sweet.
I thought about running ridiculous shit, but it is just that. Ridiculous...whacking all that super expensive shit in one unit or two or three units just seems foolish... but I dunno...maybe Paladin armies are viable...I doubt it tbh.
As for foot armies not being viable...24" is a big issue, but can be negated I think through objective placement, deployment etc, one turn of moving and running using Shrouding and then in place for good midfield coverage for the rest of the game...
I don't know.
it's very early...
Yeah. I think in my head I was just dead set on having a foot GK list.
ReplyDeleteI am thinking about playing around with a reserve/scout manipulation list, something like:
GK Master w/ PsyC or Incinerator + Grenades
Brother Captain
5x Terms w/ Psycannon Halberds
10x GK SS w/ 2x PsyC DH Rhino
9x GK SS w/ 1x PsyC DH Rhino
7 or 8 x Purifiers w/ 2x PsyC 2x DH Rhino
StormRaven
Throw the GKM and Terms in the Stormraven, give them scout at the very least. Going 1st - Set up an Alpha drop, if going 2nd Outflank (thats what the bro capt is for). 2nd unit to get scout is purifiers and 3rd is one of the other rhinos.
Pointy - yes. Could be fun.
Guess a footlist could work w/ a GKM and Libby - using scout to get a big unit into midfield and cover early (think 10x terminators).
@ven didnt quite meant razor spam in that sense, just I feel looking at these lists (they were my first idea's, including a crowe + x3 purifiers, + psyfileman dreads + GK SS for backfield) they just were a bit more "bland" than I wanted out of the codex.
I am yet to see it properly though I have to say, not seen any scans on the net, and not been to the store - though 1 of the store guys has been basically reading it to me over the phone lol
currently, i am planning on fielding one or two units of termies, a couple of rhinos worth of knights (possibly purifiers), a dreadknight, 2 dreads, and an unspecified HQ. i may also built a robot assassin, either eversor or vindicare, because i think it would be incredible cool :)
ReplyDeleteit wont win all the time, but i think it will be reasonably successful.