Monday, 3 January 2011

Tweaked, no IG!

Before I continue with the Deployment in Action (DiA) series, I have some adjustments to make.
The Imperial Guard army I play with regularly has evolved quite significantly since the beginning of the DiA series and since I began playing IG in general.
I have found how I like to play the list and it has been very successful to date.
It’s only loss has been to my own Loganwing army, played by my mate Gus..Loganwing went first and crippled half the army with extremely accurate ML fire…IG fought back but lost 8-6 on KP’s. Learnt from it though…

So what did I start with anyway? This is for you new readers! (welcome too, by the way)

CCS w. plasma in chimmie
Melta Vets in chimera’s…x 4
Demolisher Russ
Pair of Vendetta’s

Lot of Hull Heavy flamers, lot of AV12…good balance of anti tank, with a swiss-army style approach to having a tool for any problem.

But several elements just didn’t quite fit right.

The Colossus was cool, when it hit right it was pure sex…bye bye Long Fangs etc. But more often than not it just missed.

The Manticore was immense for killing tanks, but Marines got their armour save. Not cool.

The Demolisher lasted the longest…but eventually it disappeared too. Why? Too many points. Yes, I know it was only 165, but well I could get 2 Av12 vehicles for that! Well… certain Av12 tanks anyway.

The first change was a swap for Manticore to 2 Hydra’s in a squadron. Provided superb anti transport fire and suppression fire for battle tanks. The 8 S7 TL shots pumped wounds into TMC’s and elite infantry units..forcing saves.

Next change came with the Colossus going to a Medusa…or BACK to a Medusa I guess is more accurate. Well, this went too…for a Hydra and toys for the boys..

Finally the Demolisher fell for another Hydra and even more toys for the boys.

So how does my IG list look now?

CCS – 3x Plasma, Chimmie –HHF
Vets – 3x Plasma, Autocannon, Chimmie – HHF
Vets – 3x Melta, Autocannon, Chimmie – HHF
Vets – 3x Melta, Autocannon, Chimmie – HHF
Vets – 3x Flamer, Autocannon, Chimmie – HHF
Hellhound – HHF
Hydra x 2

At 1500 points this is extremely potent. We have 12 AV12 vehicles, with 14 separate threat vectors for anti-tank (15 within 24”)
What is a threat vector? A direction of attack essentially. This army can attack 14 separate targets, with a reasonably good chance of impacting each target.
In cases where we don’t need this quantity of discrete fire unit, they combine and can focus fire to produce far more reliable results.

I’m sure you can see the theme of S7 weaponry.

But it’s not all poor quality. We have 2 units of Ap2 Plasma at 24” range.. We have 6 S9 TL Lascannon shots…and of course we have a couple of melta units thrown in..

Oh and then there’s the army within the army…the transorts…with these guys we have 5 APC-suppression/pestering units… 15 S6 shots is not something to be dismissed.
It is also very useful for just pumping wounds into troops and also for forcing saves on T6 stuff.

The Hellhound has lost some of its bite in this list. With no Hull MM, it is a reduced threat versus tanks but still holds its own being able to reach out and touch people turn 1.
A fast Inferno Cannon is awesome. I’m pretty sure nobody could convince me otherwise! Although a third Vendetta could be fun… but I don’t think it would help...the Hellhound is part of the Swiss-army approach.

So lets think… does this list hold itself up to the tournament archetypes?

Razorwolf? Yup, can deal with the firepower if going second and can cripple the Razors if going first. What about the marines? Well, after they’ve been forcibly disembarked from the Razors, they have to slog it across the field. Yes, they are tough, but forcing saves via wounding on 2+’s is very effective.

Hybrid wolves like my own? Hmmm.. tough. A lot of the Hybrid wolves bite comes from Melta Hunters, TWC and HF/MM Speeders. So lets focus fire on the RifleDread and 2/3 Long Fangs units.
Lets not worry about the Scouts as we’ve spread out slightly for no multi-charge Krak or Meltabombs. Why no worry? MSU allows for one unit to die and the rest to still function at 95% capacity. I have no centre of gravity (COG – Clausewitz). Everything helps to achieve my goal. In this way, every unit is expendable. So the Scouts come on and we toast them after they’ve killed a Hydra or worst case the squadron of 2. How much did they cost again? 150. Oh. They are high on the priority of the opponent though and a likely target. Make it that way and use the Hydras as a trap, or use a unit of plasma vets as a midfield suppression and bubblewrap unit…Expensive though so no likely..I’m cool with the Scouts killing something.

Loganwing? I have found out through experience, this is a damn hard match up in some circumstances…namely? Going second is tough vs Loganwing…

Blood Angels? Mech? Straight fire fight… think I can get more shots off per turn and going first is important, or at least getting the first shots in. Tough, but I can certainly hold my own here. Jumper? Well they have limited threat vectors at 1500 and I think I can survive via smoke enough to cripple the turn after they drop…

T6’R’Us Nids? Easy. Weight of high strength fire will destroy them. Can easily survive vs the 3 possible targets from Hive Guard… Of course, target priority must be right – remove the Tervigons, then Hive Guard would be the norm…but I’d reverse it in this case and remove the threat first…hordes of Termagants are not an issue with so much flame.

Other IG…D’oh! Tough. Av12 is still good vs other Av12… S6/7 still takes a lot to get through Av12. Yes, I am aware of the hypocrisy of what I’m saying… I think this is the toughest match up.

Mech Eldar? Have enough firepower to make a those 4++ cover with rerolls very tough…can survive a dual autarch reserve lists first strike…

Orks? KFF Battlewagon? Cool, split fire base and catch in cross fire…the army is only good when they roll a tonne of 4++ cover saves.. Force them to roll enough, fail.

Other forces? Tau are tough when built in the mono-build and used properly…rarity. Chaos? Vanilla Marines? Demons…comfortable to take them on…

I’ve played against IG, Wolves, Blood Angels, Orks, Tau, Eldar, Demons all on several occasions and think this may be the one IG build for me..

What are your thoughts guys? Is this a very strong IG list? What would make it better?
What errors have I made here? Improvements….?


  1. hey, sorry i've been quiet. the holiday period has been insane (read hellish) and i have done no hobby stuff or gaming whatsoever.

    i've thought about my lists though, and as a direct result of that game i have come to very similar conclusions.

    i believe the only significant differences in my own list is that i swap a few weapons around on the vet squads and take a psyker battle squad instead of the hellhound.
    ok so there is some good psychic defence out there but most of it has only a 24 inch range and is not guaranteed to work. the battle squad enables me to cause only 2 wounds on most deathstars or other vital units and still be all but guaranteed to make them leg it. this for me, is golden, as i can then ignore them and concentrate on other elements of the enemy army.

    anyway, there will be a post up within a week on how i am converting my 4 hydras from the new chimera kit. its boring as hell, but it will be worth it in the end.

  2. I like it, plenty of hulls and dakka without relying on any one unit.

    I personally like Demos for the S10 scariness, but this works fine.

  3. @Andy - Happy New Year mate. The festive season is always manic...hope all is well.

    How many dudes are you getting for the PBS for 130? I agree with what you say, psy defence is strong, but you have range on it.

    Look forward to the conversion guide...bit late for me...all 4 of mine are built!

    @Chumby - hola! great to see you back mate, moving, family etc is ball ache!!
    The scary factor can't be dismissed, my chimera's have been surviving on the back of its psychological scare element for months now..but time for a change... :)

  4. Happy new year indeed :)

    the PBS isnt a direct swap as i'm taking less plasma than you. i'm taking 8 psykers + the overseer, since 9 is relatively pointless.

  5. Beefy list, I like it, to touch on your point where you have no "center of gravity" (thus nothing is vital if you lose) that reciprocates to the opponent as well, difficultly in targets priorities can occur on those Chimera's etc..

    Andy you still in London? We should get in another game if so.

  6. Oh and venerable, to side track for a moment, you had a chance to test that drop pod fragcannon list yet?

  7. i am still in London, but will probably not have time for a game until next week, after which i will be along every week in all likelyhood.

    arg, having trouble deciding whether to give my hydras heavy bolters of flamers. its usually an obvious choice, but with hydras, not so much. it still got to be flamers, surely? right?

  8. Andy, I'd be leaning towards the HB's - not got my codex w/ me but its a straight swap right, no point differential?

    I see the reason for the flamers (as per our game where they performed pretty damn well) but those Hydra's like to sit back, at long range, and stuff often wont be getting into flamer range, or at least for 3 or 4 turns (short of outflankers/WScouts) - HB can reach out and touch for a couple of turns - still give a bit of redundancy fire vs say AV11, or vs non-mech - its potentially another wound/save to make. Otherwise I'd prefer flamer obviously.

    I'll get a tabled booked next thurs@7:30 mate (got one this week) but maybe try and run a couple of games this or next weekend? I got a couple of things I want to play out myself.

  9. @Bully re DropCannon List...not got a trial run in yet, but will up date the blog when I do...hoping to get a cheeky game in tomorrow...will keep you informed bro.

    @Atreides- forgot to write in in...will edit now but I've started playing with a mix of HB and HHF for the Hydras...the 2 individual Hydra's have HHF so they can react to outflankers and move off on thier own if necessary vs a close range & flammable threat.
    The 2 squadron'd Hydras have HB's as they are often the most static, not needing to react to outflankers, and frankly, dying if there are WScouts (tends to be the most obvious threat in a list of hard choices), therefore they just sit back and pump out the shots.
    Has worked beautifully recently. Anecdotal evidence suggests it's a great move! Last night the squadron gunned down 4 BA Termies in one round of shooting. Other evidence, they punched through the side armour of 2 Chimera's...etc etc.
    Time will tell, but I'm enjoying it so far...