Monday night we have a little hobby evening at mine, Kabalite and Bringer are at mine and we play short games to get deployment and opening moves right through to mid game.
A lot of the time, these components are critical to getting the game off to the right start..plus with just three of us, it means we all get a game in!
The third wheel to our "dice date" paints, models, listens to a podcast (we listen to 40KUK after meeting the guys at Blog Wars - which the 3rd date has been announced for btw) or just watches and coaches/provides insight or alternatives to both sides.
I got a game in versus Kabalite and his 2K Dark Eldar list.. He went first and deployed aggressively and central with his Hellions and Baron, with flanking parties of Wyches and Trueborn. Ravagers covered flanks. He was headed for the central ruin for stealthy Baron cover + FNP = survival, then to launch out wherever the Hellions were needed.
I was doing the same with 2 x 10 Scarabs and 6 Wraiths. Barges hugged cover and floated behind the Wraiths so as to be in position first turn after the inevitable rush from the DE. Immortals hung waaaay back and in cover, one group totally out of sight. Warriors reserved.
He rushed, I lost an Annihilation barge or two, but he was central having disembarked 2 units of Trueborn and the Hellions all mid table.
I counter rushed with Scarabs and Wraiths and all 3 units charged the Hellions, winning combat by 7/8 and forcing him to fall back, despite grisly trophies.
My Command Barges swept over the Venoms in mid field and exploded them, wounding trueborn either side, one group dying to support fire and the other getting wrapped up into the mass mid field combat.
The Immortals both jumped over to take on the left hand side ravager and provide support to one another. One group scattered closer to the centre rear, bringing them in range of either the Rav or a Wych Venom. I took the Rav and the Venom.
Turn 2, I got charged by a handful of wyches who were beaten and SWEPT! Crazy. I had kept the Hellions running and whislt my mid field stuff got shot to shit it didn't really matter..there had been some seriously crushing work done in turn 1.
I got my movement right and hit stuff hard. Kabalite had very little choice other than going for the centre for cover, unless he chose not to be so aggressive with his movement and stayed put, stringing out the Hellions for cover from angles (using the midfield ruin as partially blocking rather than as area), let me push up, then get the charge with his whole force. I think, in hindsight, that that would have been the best option.
Kabalite worries that his stuff will just get shot down or stunned. This is a valid concern for a DE player, but the over aggressive, over compensation of this does often leave him too exposed..as it does for a lot of DE players.
On the otherhand, too much passivity is harmful too... Kabalite played Bringers Grey Knights next. Despite the Baron, GK's got first turn. Bringer is running:
Inq - stuff
5 DCA, 1 Crusader, Rhino
3 x 5 Purifiers, 2 Cannons, 2 Halberd, Psyback
5 x 5 Strike Squad, Cannon, Hammer, Psyback
3 x Psyflemen Dreads
In the first sentence of this post I mentioned rolling a lot of dice at 2k.. I didn't mean me...it was Bringer.
Bringer deployed centrally, so that he could move and dump his squads midfield protected from assualt by rhino chassis triangles. Turn 2 he would be ready to unleash full force to most spots on the board.
Kabalite depoys castled in one corner with Hellions out front, in cover, providing cover across the army.
Bringer moves his units across from the far right and from the centre and left (opposite the DE lines) they move up and disgorge troops in the assault protection of rhino triangles, range is good for the left hand units and for some centre left units to only move 6" and use TL-HBs too..
The resulting Psycannon fire is deadly to the DE lines.. forcing the hellions to go to ground (overly defensive) and plenty of suppression into the DE vehicles from Psybolters result in a very lack lustre Turn 1 from the DE, Turn 2 more firepower is weathered and the GK form a ring around the DE, all at range, all at maximum fire capacity. Nasty.
DE lash out to one flank and attempt to crush it and work there way down the GK line, using wreckages for cover. This works to a degree on T2 and would perhaps have worked T3, but if Bringer played the GKs right, he could have just dropped back 6" and truly punished the DE units that had made it across the board.
Time was up though so they called it.
2 very tough games for Kabalite and the DE.
Both of which have led to rethink how 2K DE work.
Something I am still thinking on..
There are so many armies that pump out extreme firepower at this points range and make it very hard for the DE to survive in their paper planes.. flickerfields and cover only do so much when the AV is that low.
Beastmasters? Can take the hits and still function at near capacity due to multiwound models?
Fellow DE players.. what can Kabalite do in the face of 2K fire power..and am I right in thinking its Beastmaster time at 2K?
Something like:
Beast Master 1 - 5 Kymarae
Beast Master 2 - 5 Kymarae
Beast Master 3 - 2 Razorwing Flocks
Beast Master 4 - 2 Razorwing Flocks
That's quite a lot of points, but pumps out a huge number of attacks and has plenty of wounds to soak up shots, keep in cover and away we go..
What do we think of Bringer's GK list? Potent enough or still going to struggle with some things? Tri-Raider Chaos lol?! Quad Raider BA?! How many Rending Psycannons can you roll up.. or S10 Hammers.. lol
Drop the first beast master and 5 Kymarae. They are there only to take S6+ shots avoiding ID on the razorwing flocks. Last time, I had 6 birds and 5 dogs and it went well, even taking a boat load of shots.
ReplyDeleteOne article I found very interesting was determining if you are the gun line, or you are the assault army. It depends on who you are and who your opponent is, and can even change mid game. I find that while SOME times, it is great to be aggressive and charge with DE, a round or two of scoot and shoot while avoiding opponents is best first, and then charge a thinned out opponent.
I agree with the first comment. I have had the most success when I move around for a couple of turns of shooting, and then charge in and clean up the survivors. You usually lose a couple of planes, but the remaining ones are usually enough. Never used beasts.
ReplyDeleteThanks FrostByte and Addict..scoot and shoot then sweep in. Accept that you'll lose a few and move in..
ReplyDeleteI think Beasts could be very cool and will soak up some serious firepower.. will give them a go and feedback.. cheers boys..
I've found Dark Eldar work best when applying pressure on an opponent. This can be through being really aggressive, delivering punishing fire power to one area of the battlefield or controling space and dictating movement. Let the pressure off and your generally in trouble.
ReplyDeleteTo achive this I use Hellions and Reavers to compliment my skimmer fleet.
Both units are fast, can get pretty much anywhere in two turns and are relitively heard to take out due to the cover save/skilled rider combo. They can also provide cover saves for your vehicles due to the height of the flight stands.
The more I think about it this is quite an interesting topic. Please fogive me if I decide to expand on it in an article of my own :P
Greg
I think Reavers are a viable alternative to units like Trueborn for sure.
ReplyDeleteExpand away my man...expand away.
Sit back and shoot, using your 38 inch range to your advantage, then commit where a weak spot has expunged itself. Dont commit turn one with your trueborn cause thats just silly, and asking for trouble.
ReplyDeleteAgainst GKs, just accept that you will lose 99% of the time.
...Just bend over and brace yourself..not a valid choice for someone with pride... ;)
ReplyDeleteLove the pic used for the article. It's one of my favorite pictures I have ever taken.
ReplyDelete